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April 19, 2004

Well Done, Please

Hey, the site IS called Grill a Christian, and I happen to own a Weber Anti-Apologetics model:

God is real. How can it be proven to you? Honestly, I can’t that is why it is by faith.

OK, so you can't prove it to me and you take it by faith. Discussion over because you've no more merit to your stance than a Muslim, a Buddhist, or a Heaven's Gater. Right?

But by using the rules of logic and common sense, the evidences for God are there and in such a vast amount that saying that there was no higher power is just a statement of arrogance in wanting life to be all about you and a statement that proves that your predisposed biases toward life keep you from being able to weigh the options and decide.

Uh, wait one second, you just said it was an unproveable matter of faith based on overwhelming evidence and logic. Errr... hmmm... has anyone ever told you that you're a walking contradiction?

Look out the window. No, I am not kidding, trying to be cute, or just stating that. Get up out of your chair, find a window, and look out and then return to reading. You looked out the window. What did you find?

A white basement window well, some rocks, and some windblown papers. I'm in awe.

How did these things get there? What force caused it? When it comes to how in the world the world happened, there tends to be two prevalent ways of thought.

Oh, are there?

The first way is that it all happened by some random chance. There was an atmospheric fart that produced the world as we know it.

Yep, everything that has ever happened has been by purely random chance. No accumulation of effects. No probabilities involved at all. Just sheer random chance. Here's an idea - pick up a book on cosmology, abiogenesis, or evolution sometime. Preferably one of each since I'm sure that you'll confuse confuse the origin of the universe, the origin of life, and the diversity of life as one and the same.

The second option which is the logical one is that there was a higher being that created the world as it is.

Well, that settles it.

Before we move on you must decide which is more logical, a Creator or a little bit of atmospheric indigestion.

OK, decided.

Before we go any further, your extremely weak apologetics have already collapsed - if the universe is so complex that it requires a creator, then your posited creator is necessarily more complex and thus requires its own creator, ad infinitum.

However, because mocking people is often too much fun to let pass, I'll also post your graceful death blow to all arguments against the existence of a god:

Logic is a standard to see if something makes sense or is reasonable. Man set up logic. Logic is man’s term from man’s dictionary for man’s standard for man’s principles. Do you agree with that equation? Is that “logical” to you? Where is God in that? You don’t see it do you. The list clearly states man, man, man, man. Where did the universe come from? We have already concluded that it must have come from God. What is the most intelligent part of the universe? Man would be the most intelligent part. So therefore, God created man and man created logic.

Uh, ok. Ummm...hmmm. Oh well, anyway, moving right along.

God created the world His way, on His timetable, and within His plan. God’s ways are God’s ways, and man’s ways are man’s ways. Therefore God isn’t ruled are controlled by man or man’s ideas, such as logic.

*sputtering*

B-b-but you just said, and I quote:

But by using the rules of logic and common sense, the evidences for God are there....

...and yet, now, you claim that God isn't ruled by logic. So why would you try to use the rules of logic to demonstrate the evidence for God?

Logic doesn’t give Christians trouble.

Well, I can name one Christian it doesn't give trouble - of course, he'd have to actually use a little bit of it before that could happen.

Keep your day job, stranger.

Update: More piss-poor apologetics for your reading pleasure, suffering the same flaw as the "undesigned designer" above. If this is as far as apologetics has come in the last 2000 years, then atheists have nothing to worry about.

What am I saying? Of course it does, since most folks tend to be generally unthinking shmoes who would believe in Binky the Magic Space Clown given half a chance (but not you, dear reader, you're bright, people like you, and Binky, blessed be his big red nose, has found favor with you).